Well, I guess I'm gonna rebuild the carb(update)

[blue65coupe]

Got the car out last night and had the same problem as before just not as bad.  Instead of waiting 10 minutes on the side of the road, I could fire the car up after it died.  It would stumble and hesitate still but nothing like before.  Weird problem but is "better".

New fuel tank, pump and filter.  Cleaned carb but not rebuilt.  New wires, plugs, cap, button and coil.  Removed e-fan.  Instead of sputtering very badly now it just kinda dies.  It will start right back with a rough idle and will come back to a smooth run for a little and then die again.  Not as bad as it was but still not driveable.  I'm making progress :toot

[lethal289]

What carb are you running?  Im sure you mentioned it before, but my memory sucks.

[blue65coupe]

Eddy 1406.  The thing only has about 1000 miles on it. 

[tarafied1]

Eddy 1406. 

never heard of that before...

[AzPete]

Sounds like vapor lock maybe......check the position of the fuel line being close to the engine block.

[blue65coupe]

I'm running a "standard route" line.  From pump up the corner of the engine, between the dizzy and carb (steel line), then goes into rubber line to filter sitting over ps valve cover and into carb.  There is plenty of clearance and nothing is touching.  Not much other way of routing.  If it's vapor locking, I'd have to find a completely different routing method.  Considering it's not as bad, is there a definitive way to tell between vapor locking and carb starvation without process of elimination?

[AzPete]

I have taken a wet rag and cooled the fuel line to see if it made any difference. Even if it does not touch, it can still get pretty hot. Could you do a temporary line with rubber fuel line to see how that works? Route it away from everything.

When the car stops, remove the air cleaner, pump the accelerator linkage as you look into the carb. See if there is gas shot into the carb. If you have gas there, it should not be a delivery problem. Be careful and protect yourself from splashing fuel.

[blue65coupe]

Gotcha.  I gotta mow grass today and have ordered the rebuild kit already so it looks like I may not have a chance to see.  I'm gonna go ahead and pull carb and r&r tomorrow when the kit gets in.  We'll see what happens.  Thanks.

[daveSanborn]

Duane,

Don't let the whole "carburator rebuild" thing intimidate you.  I rebuilt my first carb when I was 16.... an old 4V Rochester from a '65 GTO.  Follow the directions within the kit and you'll be fine.  Heck, if a dumb HS kid can rebuild an old 4V, you should have no problems...

[Midlife]

Duane,
  Heck, if a dumb HS kid can rebuild an old 4V, you should have no problems...

I didn't think Duane was that young...

[blue65coupe]

Maybe not that young, but that dumb.

[blue65coupe]

R & R'ed the carb.  No dice.  During one of the stalls I popped the air cleaner off and hit the throttle.  No gas came out of the pump jets at the front of the carb.  Hit it again and some came out.  Don't know if that's indicative of vapor locking or not.  I'm sure someone will chime in.  If so I guess I'll re-route the fuel line.  I've got an extra set of hands coming over Friday so I imagine I've said "screw it" till then.  Filter is still hot enough to where you can only hold onto it for about 5 seconds.  If it is locking, why now when nothing has really changed?

[silverblueBP]

So you didn't find any trash in the carb?

How bout posting a pic that shows your fuel feed line to the carb? Pictures may help.

[blue65coupe]

Carb was clean.  I'll get a pic if time permits.

[Fast68back]

I'll get a pic if time permits.

Your obviously not going anywhere..... :nice

[silverblueBP]

Your obviously not going anywhere..... :nice

Ouch, truth hurts don't it!

[blue65coupe]

Rick, the proper spelling would be "you're" not "your".  You're = you are     Your is possessive :bird

Anyway, just got back from another unsuccessful run.  Started missing AGAIN and when I got down the drive it was acting AGAIN like it was running on less than 8 cylinders.  Temp went up to about 210 at this point.  Almost like the timing is dumping.  Don't have time to fool with it anymore today.  I ain't touching it again 'till I have some "know how" here.  Maybe some news come Friday.

[AzPete]

R & R'ed the carb.  No dice.  During one of the stalls I popped the air cleaner off and hit the throttle.  No gas came out of the pump jets at the front of the carb.  Hit it again and some came out.  Don't know if that's indicative of vapor locking or not.  I'm sure someone will chime in.  If so I guess I'll re-route the fuel line.  I've got an extra set of hands coming over Friday so I imagine I've said "screw it" till then.  Filter is still hot enough to where you can only hold onto it for about 5 seconds.  If it is locking, why now when nothing has really changed?

"Chiming in......." If there was no gas at the carb on the first pump, it could very well be vapor locking.

[tarafied1]

"Chiming in......." If there was no gas at the carb on the first pump, it could very well be vapor locking.

I'd have to agree, hot + no gas, usually = vapor lock. It is the stock/original style mech. fuel pump? Aluminum intake? Spacer under carb? any pics of your arrangent?

[silverblueBP]

He still hasn't figured out how to take and then post pictures.

[blue65coupe]

I'll get a pic so Mark will shut up.  By the way, how's that mower coming?  Stock style pump (mechanical without the filter) with Edelbrock Performer series intake and carb.  I'm using a spacer.  I've got an extra set of hands coming over tomorrow to put a new (and smarter) brain on it.  We'll see what happens.  If it is locking why did it just decide to start?  Nothing was changed when it first happened.  Like I said, new perspective tomorrow so hopefully we'll come up with something. 

[silverblueBP]

What type of spacer (phenolic or alum) and how thick?

[AzPete]

  If it is locking why did it just decide to start?  Nothing was changed when it first happened. 

That is how a vapor lock works. There is no mechanical lock of anything. The fuel in the line and fuel pump gets hot and vaporizes. This causes the fuel to stop flowing as the vapor "locks" the line/pump. As things cool, the vapor disappears and you now have fuel movement. Time can vary based on many things. An electric fuel pump can eliminate this.

[tarafied1]

That is how a vapor lock works. There is no mechanical lock of anything. The fuel in the line and fuel pump gets hot and vaporizes. This causes the fuel to stop flowing as the vapor "locks" the line/pump. As things cool, the vapor disappears and you now have fuel movement. Time can vary based on many things. An electric fuel pump can eliminate this.

vented gas cap helps too, the spacer material might be a factor. Aluminum transfers heat, phenolic will insulate heat from the carb...

[blue65coupe]

1" spacer with the insert.  Advance bought.  I can see the vapor locking point b/c the fuel filter is so freaking hot.  I guess my question is why is it getting so hot if that's causing it?  Would it be because the fuel is heating up in the line and if so, why did that start?  I understand how vapor lock works but if that's what it did initially when nothing had been changed, why just start?  Something has to cause it to "all of a sudden start vapor locking".  If it is vapor locking that would explain the rough running as if the timing was retarded which would cause it to heat up to 210*.  Where as I thought the initial heating up could have caused the problem, it actually might have been an effect from the problem.  (I had that brainstorm last night)  I threw out a few extra ideas to the guy coming over tomorrow so we'll see.  It just needs a new person looking at it.  Also Pete, if it's vapor locking due to the fuel heating up somewhere within the line (I"m saying not carb due to the heat of the fuel filter) how is an e-pump gonna solve this?  Could it be the pump is heating up due to the engine and the e-pump would eliminate this?  If so, why "just start for no reason"?  I'm gonna buy some more fuel line tomorrow b/c if he thinks that's what it is we'll re-route the line to find out.