Author Topic: roller spring perch/uca ? (Read 1395 times)

Dne' · « **on:** July, 27, 2009, 01:11:58 PM »

Since I have my motor kind of in my '67 stang, I was able to attempt attaching the lower portion of my front shocks. I have roller spring perches. My question is; is the back portion of the spring perch supposed to clear the inside of the UCA? On the passenger side, it just clears it by a hair and I'm worried it may get stuck or rub during suspension travel! ON the drivers side, it does not clear the uca at all, and just butts up against it and no way will the back portion of the spring perch travel freely through the UCA. Do I have an issue with clearance here? am I going to have to grind the inner portion of the UCA's to allow the spring perches to clear the UCA's? I hope you can understand what I'm saying!
dne'

Starfury · « **Reply #1 on:** July, 27, 2009, 02:42:43 PM »

I think I understand, but...do you have the engine resting in the car? Or is it supported by a hoist? IIRC, the suspension shouldn't have enough travel to cause any interference between the UCA and spring perch. Hook the shock up and jack the car up by the frame rails or crossmember to check clearance.

Dne' · « **Reply #2 on:** July, 27, 2009, 03:51:11 PM »

The engine/trany was installed together and the full weight is placed upon the stang. No engine hoist holding the motor up. I will be re-installing some other motor supports in the near future. So with full weight (except lacking fenders and hood), I placed my floor jack beneath one lower control arm to obtain maximum compression to attach the lower nuts on a shock(one at a time of course). I was able to on the P side, but the drivers side, I couldn't get the outter nut on because the perch would't rotate.
Again, on the drivers side, the back portion of the spring perch hits the UCA and won't follow through. Whereas on the passenger side, it will go through.

I finally got my camera back! Here is the driver's side setup. I've compressed the spring out of the way to get at the perch. The tip of the large screwdriver shows where the perch is hitting the UCA, this perch will not pivot back all the way behind the UCA. When I tried to install the bottom of the shock, I couldn't get the outter nut on. the perch was tilted because it was caught on the UCA. The other side was Ok, but only by a smidgeon! These are not the most expensive UCA's, I'm just concerned they're not made correctly. OK?

Quote from: Starfury on July, 27, 2009, 02:42:43 PM

I think I understand, but...do you have the engine resting in the car? Or is it supported by a hoist? IIRC, the suspension shouldn't have enough travel to cause any interference between the UCA and spring perch. Hook the shock up and jack the car up by the frame rails or crossmember to check clearance.

AzPete · « **Reply #3 on:** July, 27, 2009, 04:10:10 PM »

I believe the upper control arm should sit more level than it appears to if attached to the spring. Can you get a picture with the spring compressor out and the spring on the perch? Maybe you have to much spring. The fenders and hood will bring it down but I am not sure how much.

Dne' · « **Reply #4 on:** July, 27, 2009, 04:28:28 PM »

Gee Pete, When I had the full weight of the car on the suspension(-hood/fenders)the UCA's remained at a strong angle(I didn't get a photo). I'll put it back together tomorrow; pretty easy to let the spring back down. The rear end is up as high as my jack will go and on jack stands, would that make a difference? When you say too much spring, like these were intended for a big block? I guess I'll have to wait until I have the car completely together to see how it's going to sit. :cry

This photo is of a suspension and the perches are able to rotate into the UCA(I found this on Google search).

AzPete · « **Reply #5 on:** July, 27, 2009, 04:44:08 PM »

For sure, I would not make any major changes until you do have full weight on it. On the springs, there are several different types and it depends on what you have as to how it sits. The rear being high will make no difference to speak of. Since there is no left or right to the perches, you could swap them and see if there is a slight difference.

Starfury · « **Reply #6 on:** July, 27, 2009, 05:29:57 PM »

I don't recall my arms sitting at anywhere near that kind of angle with the weight of the vehicle on the suspension.

tarafied1 · « **Reply #7 on:** July, 27, 2009, 05:50:05 PM »

here is a shot of my car without the engine. The angle is still more than with all the weight on it but you get the idea...

Dne' · « **Reply #8 on:** July, 27, 2009, 06:00:03 PM »

Well, I thank ya'll for your thoughts!

I'll just not worry about this for now. When I have it ALL together, maybe it'll be alright when it has all it's weight on the suspension. The springs were purchased from laurelmountainmustang, stock springs. so, put this thread to rest for now.
dne'

Dne' · « **Reply #9 on:** July, 28, 2009, 09:22:29 AM »

I remedied the spring perch problem by taking my angle grinder and grinding away unecessary spring perch(only 1/8"-3/16" or so. and the clearance is great. Shocks are mounted now.
Now I'm kind of depressed about the front height. My husband came out and put all his 245lbs on the front and barely moved it downward! is there a chance that the springs are for big block? or what can I do? I'm an expert at removing/installing springs! lol
dne'

AzPete · « **Reply #10 on:** July, 28, 2009, 10:07:19 AM »

Yep....looks a bit high........wait until allweight is on the car and you have moved the car to allow the wheels to reposition properly.

Then....

1. buy a big block and use it

2. different springs

3. cut the springs you have

4. install transfer case and front differential

garner67 · « **Reply #11 on:** July, 28, 2009, 10:46:40 AM »

After you have all the weight on the car (looks like you're almost there), just cut the coils down a bit.

Looking at your current height, I'd probably start with at least 1/2 a coil on your first cut. If that's not enough, then cut 1/4 coil each additional cut until you have the ride height you want. Since this is a free modification, you might as well try it before going out and buying new springs... or a big block engine! :yikes

Along with the 1" lowered a-arm, I have 1" lowering springs on my car, and I still had to cut 3/4 of a coil to get the ride height I wanted.
Here's a pic...

Fast68back · « **Reply #12 on:** July, 28, 2009, 11:01:19 AM »

I think I got lucky........ I have the upper control arm drop and 620 springs. I have a picture around somewhere showing the huge difference in the springs. I'll dig it up later and add it to the post

Midlife · « **Reply #13 on:** July, 28, 2009, 02:31:22 PM »

Just on a lark...loosen your LCA bolts and jump on the bumper/fender a few times to get the front to drop. Then tighten your LCA bolts again. They should only be tightened under full load and on suspension.

Dne' · « **Reply #14 on:** July, 28, 2009, 05:28:50 PM »

Yeah, cut the springs

! And I will loosen the LCA bolts tomorrow to see how that does. Do I use a sawzall to cut the springs? or a cutoff wheel?

I'm amazed how stiff the springs are! Even Gary(husband) can hardly budge the suspension!

What would be the difference in big block springs vs. small block springs? Could I possibly have BB springs?

I would like to mention that I did drill the holes for the Shelby drop, but Bruce at Surefirerestoration advised that I didn't need to do that, so right now the UCA's are in the original holes. Should I use the Shelby drop or not?

lethal289 · « **Reply #15 on:** July, 28, 2009, 06:16:27 PM »

i have the stock springs on my car too, you can see in my sig how the front is still in the air. I think its pretty common and like you, i will be trimming them soon! Ohh, and a cut off wheel, will be much cleaner / quicker!

Dne' · « **Reply #16 on:** July, 28, 2009, 06:31:52 PM »

OMG! Well, that about answers it then! Is that the way Mustang's rode?
I appreciate you replying Lethal289! How much do you think you will cut off of the coil springs? What a PIA! lol I can rest now!!
dne'

Quote from: lethal289 on July, 28, 2009, 06:16:27 PM

i have the stock springs on my car too, you can see in my sig how the front is still in the air. I think its pretty common and like you, i will be trimming them soon! Ohh, and a cut off wheel, will be much cleaner / quicker!

lethal289 · « **Reply #17 on:** July, 28, 2009, 06:43:31 PM »

Like mentioned, im going to start with a half coil, but my gut tells me it going to be atleast 3/4. And if i screw it up, im going to get some 620 springs next. I wonder if when these cars came off the assembly line, if the front was a little higher then the back?

Fast68back · « **Reply #18 on:** July, 28, 2009, 09:05:48 PM »

I think they were front end high to make it easier to steer the non power steering cars.

Dne' · « **Reply #19 on:** July, 29, 2009, 04:59:40 AM »

What is the deal about 620 springs? are they springier, or just what makes them so special?

Quote from: lethal289 on July, 28, 2009, 06:43:31 PM

Like mentioned, im going to start with a half coil, but my gut tells me it going to be atleast 3/4. And if i screw it up, im going to get some 620 springs next. I wonder if when these cars came off the assembly line, if the front was a little higher then the back?

Fast68back · « **Reply #20 on:** July, 29, 2009, 05:11:13 AM »

The 620 refers to spring rate

Quote

What is Spring Rate?
Spring rate refers to the amount of weight needed to compress a spring an inch (Example:500# per inch) To understand and properly check a spring for rate you need to know the factors that determine the rate of the spring.

http://www.afcoracing.com/tech_pages/spring.shtml

Dne' · « **Reply #21 on:** July, 29, 2009, 05:41:34 AM »

Thank you!

I understood the entire tech writeup! :dumas I'll just cut my springs for now! When I get back from the eye doctor, I"m going to cut half a coil off my springs. It'd be much easier now than when all together. I really dislike compressing springs, I feel like I'm defusing a bomb that could go off in my face!

Quote from: Fast68back on July, 29, 2009, 05:11:13 AM

The 620 refers to spring rate

http://www.afcoracing.com/tech_pages/spring.shtml

cmayna · « **Reply #22 on:** July, 29, 2009, 06:15:12 AM »

I'd use a cut off wheel to chop a coil spring. Don't think a sawzall would do it.

Dne' · « **Reply #23 on:** July, 29, 2009, 12:36:56 PM »

I took the first spring out, and 1/2 a coil just didn't seem like enough, so I did a 3/4 of a coil cut. I'm amazed how tough the spring material is! My Cut off tool worked very well. I forgot to do an initial measurement, but before I did the passenger side, it started with 34.75"(measuring from the top of the radiator support) and ended with 33.5". I'll leave it there and maybe with the added weight of the radiator, alt, compressor, hood, me, Gary, maybe it will settle some. I did loosen the LCA bolts(eccentric)camber adjusting nuts and bounced on the car best I could, then retightned. I've had enough for today! I do really like my Snap-on coil spring compressor!
PS: thanks for everyone's advice!

!!
dne'