Engine has to come out.

[68EFIvert]

I had a string of bad luck with the car lately.  It started out with a short in a courtesy light that wasn't too bad to track down but did not stop there.  Right as I found the problem with the light I started the car up and it ran great.  The next time I started the car it started making a noise after a couple seconds of running.  It ran really bad and gave me some different codes from the engine code reader.  I could not find an electical issue so I called over the engine guy and we started diagnosing/taking apart the car until we found the problem. 

We narrowed it down to a bad lifter or broken dog bone in the lifter valley.  We ran out light before I could take the lower intake off.  I did it the next day and found a broken dog bone that holds the lifter in place.  Pretty frustrating since the engine only have about 1500 miles on it.  The first 1000 miles was putting around breaking the engine in before the tune was set in the computer.  I will be taking the engine out this week or next weekend.  I just hope it didn't wipe out the custom cam.     I think the dog bone broke while idling in the garage so I hope it did not cause any collateral damage. 

Anyone know why a dog bone would break?  My builder recommend I buy tie bar lifters since he had an issue with them breaking in the past.  I elected to just stay with Comp Cams lifters and OEM dog bones.  That $200 in savings then is going to cost me over $1000 if I can save the cam and maybe over $2000 if I need a new cam and new tune on the engine.  I have a new set of tie bar lifters, headgaskets, and all the other gaskets I will need on the way.  I will take the engine down to the builder for him to look at the bearings while I am at it. 

I will do a couple things while the engine is out.  The first will find the damn oil leak that pisses all over my floor.  The second is more fun.  I think I will have the engine guy do a bowl blend on the heads.  When I built the engine a couple years ago I skipped the tie bar lifters and a bowl blend, eveything else was overbuilt. 

[tarafied1]

ouch!

[silverblueBP]

Sorry to hear the bad news Darreld. I've been there too many times recently.

[mmw68]

Damn! Well - happy father's day!

[monkeystash]

It doesn't appear that the lifter rotated at all.  Hopefully all is well internally.  Good luck!

[66gt350]

It doesn't appear that the lifter rotated at all.  Hopefully all is well internally.  Good luck!

+1

It's still has half of the dog-bone attached, so that should have kept the lifter from turning.

[68EFIvert]

+1

It's still has half of the dog-bone attached, so that should have kept the lifter from turning.

I sure hope you guys are right.  The engine guy said that the last engine he saw that lost the dog bone only had one side that was gone.  The only problem is that it still wiped out the cam.  Keeping my fingers crossed.  I hope to have the time this week to pull everything off the engine so that I can push the car out of the garage to pull the motor.  We are in a rental house while our new house is being built and the garage is filled with crap.  Just enough space to park my car and slide along beside it. 

[68EFIvert]

Not good news.  The dog bone did allow the lifter to rotate and then broke the roller off the lifter.  It also wiped out my cam.  To top it off I was using a Camshaft innovations custom grind and I think Jay Allen is out of business.  I sent him a message a few days ago asking him about a replacement if I needed one and still haven't heard from him.  It looks like I either try to find out who actually ground my cam and see if they still have the specs or go with another brand/grinder.  I have heard good things about FTI and almost went with him when I got my last cam. 

Anyone have a good recommendation for a blower cam?  I don't mind custom cams because I think you get what you pay for but am not opposed to OTS if it is proven to be good.

[silverblueBP]

OUCH



I feel your misery and pain.

[67 Fastback]

Not good news.  The dog bone did allow the lifter to rotate and then broke the roller off the lifter.  It also wiped out my cam.  To top it off I was using a Camshaft innovations custom grind and I think Jay Allen is out of business.  I sent him a message a few days ago asking him about a replacement if I needed one and still haven't heard from him.  It looks like I either try to find out who actually ground my cam and see if they still have the specs or go with another brand/grinder.  I have heard good things about FTI and almost went with him when I got my last cam. 

Anyone have a good recommendation for a blower cam?  I don't mind custom cams because I think you get what you pay for but am not opposed to OTS if it is proven to be good.

That sucks. Yeah, Jay is a mess right now from what I gather. The board that I frequent that Jay was on is suggesting Mark at Bullet Cams or Cammotion.
Bill

[68EFIvert]

I don't suppose the other board is SBFtech.com is it?  I posted the same question there as well as VMF.  Thanks for the info on the other grinders!  Once the cam comes out of the engine I hope there is some sort of number on it that would allow me to check with those grinders to see if they did the original work on my current cam.  Keep my fingers crossed.

[67 Fastback]

Yeah, I responded there as well lol. Do you not have your cam card? Should be easy to duplicate with that.
Bill

[68EFIvert]

I do have the cam card saved on my work computer.  I will have to reprint a copy of it.  I want to get the cam out before I start calling places so that I can tell them the numbers ground on it when they ask.  Thanks Bill.

[67 Fastback]

I'd start with Comp on the cam. I'd see if it is there lopes. If so, voila. I'd just hate to call a custom cam grinder and pay them the same money to duplicate an already spec'd cam. Know what I mean.
Bill

[Horseplay]

When you pull the engine you can just take the cam out and ship it off to be reproduced. Only one lobe is messed up...you still have the other seven and eight a cam manufacturer can spec out. This would seem the best way to go since everything else is set up to work with this cam profile.

[66gt350]

You might want to give Clay Smith Cams a call.  They are very helpful and knowledgeble when it comes to custom cams.  I had them grind me one when I had the 351W in my fastback.  Boy did that motor scream.  I was turned on to them by a buddy of mine down in So Cal, he knew the previous owner, George Striegel.  If (I mean when) I decided to toss the E303 cam in the trash, I'll be giving them a call. 

[silverblueBP]

Just so you have another cam option...my cam is a custom grind from Dema Elgin. It's worked great all these years. I've had to replace the cam twice (no fault of the cam) and it's been the exact same grind each time.

Gave him all the engine info, what tranny and gears and how it was going to be run. He took care of the rest.

[buening]

If you want the same cam back, pretty much any cam grinder should be able to hook you up I would think.  Hell, I think even Comp Cams does custom grinds if you ask.  I have no clue what they charge though.  Was yours a TLSR or hydraulic roller?

[68EFIvert]

The cam is a hydraulic roller.  I sent an email to Bullit Cams on Saturday in the hopes they did the original grind.  If they did not I am not sure what way I am going to go.  Take the cam to a local grinder for a replacement or get start over again with a new grinder.  Thanks for the info and recommendations on cam grinders.  I'll keep you posted on what I end up doing.

[68EFIvert]

I spoke with Kirk at Bullet Racing Cams today.  He seems like a nice guy with good ideas on how I culd improve the cam I have.  I mentioned to him I thought the torque was a little low (486 rwft) and would like a bit more.  Not as concerned about the power.  The last cam gave me 555 at the wheels.  I sent him the full specs on my current cam and he is going to get back to me in the next day or so with his recommendation. 

I have also decided to do a bowl blend on the heads while the engine is apart.  Should pick up a bit more power with that.  The engine guy will also replace all the bearings in the engine and clean the block.  I don't want to have anything I "wish I would have done" when this is over.  I've learned cutting corners, even when you don't think you are (good aftermarket lifters but using OEM dog bones), is way to expensive.

[buening]

Yeah that was a real kick in the nuts man, and honestly I wouldn't have thought the dog bones would have created problems.  Sounds like you are in good hands at Bullet Racing.  I've heard some good stuff about them, hopefully they come through.  Whats a few more dyno hours of tuning at this point???   LOL

[65fast]

I went with an Ed Curtis (FTI) cam for my N/A 306 build.  It was a hydraulic roller, it took awhile to get it ground, but I believe Comp was short on cores at the time.

Either way, once it finally got the motor going I couldn't of been happier.  Ed was a pleasure to work with.

[68EFIvert]

I mailed my old cam off today to Kirk at Bullet cams.  He thinks we may be able to regrind it.  If I can use it that will save me about $300 bucks.  Well worth the shipping on my old cam.  I went to look at the carnage of my engine today.  It appears that my lifters may have been the cause not the dog bone.  When the engine guy attemped to pull the lifters out of the bores 5 of them would not come up.  He had to pull the cam and then drop the lifters down.  When they came out he noticed the pins that hold the roller in place was working their way out on those 5.  It was bad enough that the pins stuck out past the lifter inhibiting it from being removed.  So much for quality Comp Cams lifters.  The crappy thing is they only carry a warranty of 1 year.  I purchased my 18 months ago.   

[buening]

I'd still be getting on the phone to Comp Cams and letting them know what happened.  I'd be giving them an earfull, as that sort of thing should not happen in that short amount of time

[silverblueBP]

Are the lifter bores OK?