T-5 Conversion, Hydraulic Clutch Conversion Kit, Which one???

[RyanG85]

Doing some research on hydraulic clutch kits for my 65 with T-5. Seems a supplier has gone out of business that supplied NPD, Mustangs Unlimited and others.... I see a McLeod kit at Mustangs Plus. Any pros or cons to that kit? What other ones are available?  Thanks.

[Fast68back]

I am running the Mcleod Hyd throw out bearing and other than it being fairly stiff, I dont have any issues with the setup. I replaced the MC with a CNC unit purely for aesthetic reasons. I also bought a CNC reservoir because I didn't care much for the looks of the plastic reservoir that the McLeod kit used. One thing the kit fails to mention is the need for a spacer to put the TO close enough to the clutch to actuate it.

CNC reservoir


The CNC MC (ignore the ugly brake MC, it has been addressed)

[RyanG85]

That looks pretty sweet. When you say fairly stiff, how bad is it? Is it better than a Z-bar or cable set up as far as feel? I know it gives the best header clearance.

[Fast68back]

Mine is pretty damn stiff, but I really dont mind it. I think a lot depends on the angle from the MC to the pedal. I've heard that guys use a bracket on a lot of the cobra kit cars that is supposed to help the angle and make the activation a little easier.

[Shaun]

I have no experience with this but I know Bruce through the NorCal-SAAC.  This looks interesting - http://moderndriveline.com/catalog/hydraulics.htm

[Fast68back]

Cool, do they sell just the bracket on the inside of the firewall? I'd like to try one of those.

[RyanG85]

Excellent Shaun! Just got off the phone with them. Very helpful and just what I was looking for! Thanks

[RyanG85]

Rick, Try this link: http://moderndriveline.com/catalog/custom_mustang_sb_T5_kit.htm

Lets you pick any part of the system to "build your own"

[Shaun]

Excellent Shaun! Just got off the phone with them. Very helpful and just what I was looking for! Thanks

How many $'s is the complete kit?

[RyanG85]

$498 with external slave and $632 with internal.  They told me it was a matter of personal preference on internal vs. ex. Any opinion on which is better? I think the savings between the 2, I'd opt for the external unless someone can tell me they are not as good.

[Fast68back]

Ryan, you did see the

External style slave, 24" steel braided line, & LF Series Master   $498.50
(67-70 only, 65-66 is in development,
see Hydraulics page for more information)

comment, right?

[buening]

I was just about to say that the 65-66 was under development unless he has them figured out.....or you get to be the guinea pig Ryan   :scar

Rick, you mention a hard pedal.  Did you use the stock hole in the firewall for your MC pushrod and use the original hole in the clutch pedal?  Sometimes people install the MC lower on the pedal and firewall and lose some of the leverage compared to the stock location.  Reasons for that are brake booster interference, but you don't have one of those.  Also, what bore MC are you using??

There are a few guys over on 1969stang.com that are using the Moderndriveline hydraulic setup on their 69/70 cars.  Other than the MC being undersized and having to send it back to get a bigger one (0.625 to a 0.700), they haven't had any install issues. That shouldn't happen now though.  Neither cars are on the road yet though and have only been mocked up.  

I'm not sure what Bruce charges for the hydraulic throwout bearing, but RAM makes a fairly reasonably priced ($200) TO bearing for Tremec trans.  I wonder if you could get the RAM bearing and Bruce's MC setup for a cheaper solution?  I was quoted by Bruce about $230 just for the MC kit without the TO bearing. For $430 plus buying the hoses you could save a few bucks. I'm not trying to take away from Bruce's business by any means, just throwing out possible options. You risk deviating from the "kit" and may run into problems.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/RAM-78130/  

[buening]

From what little I know about hydraulic clutches, the hydraulic thowout bearing offers a clean setup and install.  The downside is that you have to pull the trans to service the bearing and if you have a leak from the bearing there is a chance fluid could get on your clutch. The downside to the external slave is that it is subject to all the grime and stuff from the road.  I've heard people having issues with them alongside headers and the heat causing the fluid to heat up and cause a soft pedal.  I'm sure some heat protection could be used, or may not be an issue if your headers aren't close. External setups also still retain the clutch fork, so clearance issues with headers can also be a problem depending on where they land.  Mocking up my T56, my headers don't come anywhere close to the clutch fork.  I'm still really on the fence on going external or internal.   I'd go clutch cable if they were so darn long and wouldn't burn up from header heat.  I can't stand seeing a cable protrude from the firewall clear past the shock tower and then you have to weave through the header tubes to get to the fork.

[garner67]

I purchased all my T5 conversion parts from ModernDriveline.  When I initially purchased and install everything they did not have this nice bracket and MC mounting setup.



In my original setup, the clutch MC was centered in the original firewall clutch rod hole location, but it had a VERY stiff clutch pedal feel.   I could have had made it softer clutch if I would have move the MC about an inch higher, but I didn't want to mess with cutting up my firewall.

Then Bruce designed the new bracket system, and he sent me this new part and a new MC.  Now my clutch feel is nearly as easy as my Toyota Tacoma hydraulic clutch feel.

I'm sure you probably could piece together a hydraulic clutch setup from individual parts cheaper than ModernDriveline's kits, but I don't mind paying a few more bucks to get excellent customer support and well designed parts.   I feel much better about supporting great American vendors like ModernDriveline, OpentrackerRacing, StreetOrTrack, etc.

[RyanG85]

Ryan, you did see the  comment, right?

Yes I did see that. They had to design a different mount due to the contours of the 65-66 firewall. Its designed and (hopefully) tested and will be in stock within two weeks.

[Fast68back]

I sent them an e-mail asking about the bracket, here is the reply I received...

No, only as a kit, the kit is $235. 

Regards, Bruce
Modern Driveline Inc.
"Your five/six speed conversion source"
208-453-9800 ext 101

[66gt350]

That's a shame.  But, IIRC, I think that I moved the hole a little bit on the firewall, so it was more of a straight shot.  I do like the looks of that bracket.

[Shaun]

I sent them an e-mail asking about the bracket, here is the reply I received...

What do you get in the kit for $235?

[Fordrevhead]

That new bracket from modern driveline looks like the ticket.  They have the mechanical advantage versus the throw all worked out.  This should give an easier pedal feel.  I'll be lookin into that kit (once I get a transmission), lol.

[RyanG85]

I sent them an e-mail asking about the bracket, here is the reply I received...

Rick, you'll get the master cylinder linkage system and braided steel line in that kit.

[buening]

What do you get in the kit for $235?

The Master Cylinder, all the lever/bracketry for the pushrod to clutch pedal connection, rubber hose and reservoir.  The first link to the ModernDriveline Hydraulics has a picture of everything that comes in the kit for the $235.  An extra $40 will get you a 24" braided hydraulic hose, and I was quoted roughly $360 for the hydraulic throwout bearing (for my T56).

[Shaun]

The Master Cylinder, all the lever/bracketry for the pushrod to clutch pedal connection, rubber hose and reservoir.  The first link to the ModernDriveline Hydraulics has a picture of everything that comes in the kit for the $235.  An extra $40 will get you a 24" braided hydraulic hose, and I was quoted roughly $360 for the hydraulic throwout bearing (for my T56).

Not bad!  Saves a bunch of time trying to figure out angles/lengths etc. crammed under the dash in the fetal position!

[garner67]

I can understand wanting to only sell the bracket in kits.  You're not only buying the bracket, you're buying all the time and effort that went into designing and testing.  If he only sold the bracket he'd loose out on a larger sale. 

Bruce runs a good honest business, and I assume he wants to stay above water in these tough economic times, and $235 for the bracket, MC, reservoir and hardware seems like a fair price to me.

[guruatbol]

Both of mine came from JMC which is now out of business.  I guess I should look at them and see what they are so I can see if I can get parts.

I like them and the pedal is nice!  just like it should be.   The 65 is on the lift, I think I'll take a pic or two!

Mel

[buening]

Both of mine came from JMC which is now out of business.  I guess I should look at them and see what they are so I can see if I can get parts.

I like them and the pedal is nice!  just like it should be.   The 65 is on the lift, I think I'll take a pic or two!

Mel

IIRC you likely have CNC brand master and slaves if they came from JMC.  http://www.cncbrakes.com/mc.asp?grp=mc&subgrp=swo&series=711&subseries=